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Forum:Math QOTD: Recoil
I've partially gotten my head around damage and accuracy. Clip size and fire rate are mostly self-explanatory. Elemental effects are iffy, but I'm working on that. However, there is one other noteworthy variable with regard to weaponry that doesn't even appear on a weapon's pane -- recoil. Now, I understand what Recoil is, literally. That isn't in question. But how do we know how much recoil to expect? The only thing I can find anywhere on the wiki about recoil is that Dahl weapons supposedly have less of it. That doesn't tell me how much to expect, or how it differentiates by weapon type (or sub-weapon type for that matter.) For that matter, it doesn't tell me how recoil actually behaves. And if I have "50% recoil reduction," that cuts the kick in half, right? Lastly, does Sniper Rifle sway count as recoil? It's kick from the gun that causes you to be off-center after a shot, so one would think so, but the fact that it's worded differently in proficiencies and such makes me wonder. I mean, there aren't any automatic snipes out there. --Azuarc 17:28, January 14, 2010 (UTC) (did I not sign this originally?) : The only instance of an "automatic sniper rifle" I've seen are ones with "BAM BAM BAM BAM BAM!" that have burst fire while zooming. Hypothesis: Recoil appears to be the rate at which the aiming reticule expands per shot. Weapons should have a base 'recoil' rate at which their reticule expands, recoil reduction should reduce this rate. Sway is different, sway has to do with the movement of the sniper rifle reticle while you are zoomed. While recoil reduction should work with sniper rifles (although not terribly useful unless it has a high RoF), it should not do anything to remove the sway of the rifle. As for elemental damage, have you taken a look at: http://gbxforums.gearboxsoftware.com/showthread.php?t=86431? Ocdscale 01:53, January 14, 2010 (UTC) I think that sway is the amount of movement a sniper has while you are zoomed in and standing still. I read somewhere that crouching reduces sway. Also, there actually is an automatic sniper (the penetrator). I find with my soldier's recoil reduction effects that the recoil reduction doesn't reduce maximum recoil, but it does seem to make me able to fire longer before reaching the maximum loss of accuracy. I've never had to worry about recoil except on automatic weapons, and I usually fix any recoil issues by firing in bursts. Machine guns, machine pistols, and smgs have the most, but I usually am not aiming for too many criticals with these anyways. These are just my observations though. Freed23 00:28, January 14, 2010 (UTC) I believe that recoil is the time elapsed before that maximum loss of accuracy. 50% can't cut the kick in half, however, as a Rifleman mod can give you up to 180% recoil reduction before any other bonuses you may have applied. Sway is entirely different, and can be reduced by crouching. The time, I expect, works like the time for the Soldier's turret cooldown - if Deploy cuts the time by "100%", it actually just cuts it in half. Therefore, +100% recoil reduction means twice the time to reach that maximum loss of accuracy. -- Claptrap 02:42, January 14, 2010 (UTC) ---- Thank you for the initial responses. Yes, I've seen the elemental damage thread, or else I would have been *completely* clueless. I can agree with the assertions here that Sway is not Recoil. However, they're related ideas, so I wanted to get other opinions. I'm certainly not a master sniper. "180% recoil reduction" doesn't make any sense. If you reduce something by 100%, you've taken it away completely. If you INCREASE the RATE of something by 100%, it will DECREASE the TIME by 50%, which is what Roland's turret ability (Deploy) should say. I suppose I can take from this that GearBox tooltip writers don't understand extremely basic real-world algebra, and that we can't necessarily trust anything else that we're presented with, either. However, if that's true, what are we reducing for recoil? Are we reducing the amplitude of the recoil effect, or -- as claptrap suggests -- the speed at which it reaches that maximum amplitude? If I'm firing a Revolution, and I expend the whole clip, do I end up just as wildly inaccurate in the end with a Recoil Reduction mod? (Pity I got rid of mine.) --Azuarc 17:28, January 14, 2010 (UTC) :If we were to go with the idea I put forth above, it would depend on the amount of recoil reduction. If the weapon could fire for long enough without stopping, which is quite possible with a Revolution, it wouldn't matter how much recoil reduction you had - as it would fire for longer than the longest time you could delay the "maximum loss of accuracy". On another note, recoil reduction should not be confused with accuracy recovery (obtained with a Ranger mod for a Hunter), which reduces the time it takes to get from an enlarged aiming reticule to the normal size. Theoretically, combining high recoil reduction with good accuracy recovery would mean that it takes longer to reach a larger reticule, and when you stop firing, it swiftly shrinks back. -- Claptrap 21:32, January 14, 2010 (UTC)